Re: [Cz-L] Help in translating death cert. and stone

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X-edited-by: culrich_at_incentre.net
Date: Tue, 5 Apr 2005 10:21:32 EDT
Reply-To: romers_at_shaw.ca
Sender: owner-CZERNOWITZ-L_at_cornell.edu
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Czernowiters:

Many thanks to all those who responded to my plea for help in deciphering
the stone and death certificate of Scheindel Schatten. A special thank you
to Peter Elbau and Berti Glaubach for their most professional translation
from German to English of Scheindel's death certificate, and to David
Kessler for his work and research on both Scheindel's and Seinwel's stones.
Thanks also to the Listmeister who provided the raw data in the first place.

Below might be more than you wanted to know, but because so many responded,
I will take the bandwidth to tell you how things turned out:

Both Scheindel and Seinwel are the children of 'a' Rabbi Josef. Both stones
contained " ...son of (daughter of) ... our teacher, our Rabbi Josef". And
as well, it turns out that Seinwel was also a Rabbi. Both Seinwel and
Scheindel were born in Podhajce within seven years of each other and died in
Czernowitz within 10 years of each other. All that is now documented.

So, either one believes the circumstantial evidence which suggests that
Seinwel and Scheindel were brother and sister

OR

There could have been two Rabbi Josef's in Podhajce in the last half of the
19th century both around the same age; one of whom had a surname of Schatten
and was the progenitor of Seinwel; and the other whose surname was quite
different (or maybe not), but whose daughter married a Schatten and was the
progenitor of Scheindel.

OR???

Regardless, I was most pleased to find out that there was more than one
Rabbi in the tree.

Thanks again to all,

jerome


----- Original Message -----
From: "jerome schatten" <romers_at_shaw.ca>
To: <czernowitz-l_at_cornell.edu>
Sent: Friday, April 01, 2005 12:20 PM
Subject: [Cz-L] Help in translating death cert. and stone


> Czernowitzers:
>
> It appears that Scheindel Schatten might be the sister of my ggf.
>
> I have posted temporarily at
> http://members.shaw.ca/czernowitz/webperson/
> the images of both her death certificate (in German) and her grave stone
> (in
> Hebrew). I can see that she is the daughter of a 'Josef', and so is my
> ggf
> Seinwel. Both were born in Podhajce, lived for some years in Czernowitz,
> and are buried in the Czernowitz cemetery. The hypothesis that they are
> brother and sister is plausible if Schatten is her maiden name or she was
> never married.
>
> I do know the given and maiden names of Seinwel's wife, and thus have
> ruled
> out that Scheindel and Seinwel were married.
>
> I'm hoping that these two images will shed some light on how she might be
> related to me.
>
> Thanks for any ideas you might have,
> Best,
> jerome
Received on 2005-04-07 06:22:38